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My serious question is this: how do we stop terrorism and criminals when they have access to military grade encryption technology?

It seems like there is a lot of ideological push for freedom, but as criminal activity moves to the virtual world, have we not created a problem for ourselves?



The same way you would stop terrorist group who only talk face to face with each other.


If you let fear be your guide you would never even leave the house. Don't do bad things and there won't be terrorists. Attack other countries, incite wars and you'll have them.

It's simple. Don't be a douche and no one will slap your face.


That seems like such a gross oversimplification I don’t even know where to start. There will always be those in society who want to do harm for one reason or another, utopia does not exist. These people are what we call criminals.


Most criminals are criminals because of the circumstances. Circumstances can be improved but they'd rather spend 5.5 billion (the one after the million) € on Eurofighters than make away with poverty.

We could go back and forth and it would change nothing at all because no one from the EC will see it and as an EU citizen I can't change the resolution, because the EP can't do anything about it.

And just because there are "criminals" doesn't mean that I have to live behind steel bars in my house and let every letter be seen by some policeman before I read it. We're also not talking about criminals, we're talking about some guy who's country was attacked, maybe his family killed. Who knows what his motives were? I don't. US, EU, Russia, Turkey all waged a proxy war in Syria. If not for that war maybe he would not had done what he did. If not for 9/11 there would be no ISIS.

Why does the US have to plunder other countries? Instigate wars in other countries? If anything we should send to refugees to the US because they're to blame for it all.


> Why does the US have to plunder other countries? Instigate wars in other countries? If anything we should send to refugees to the US because they're to blame for it all.

It's not just the US, you said it yourself - France, Russia, Turkey, Saudi Arabia, the EU (agricultural subsidies make it impossible for local African farmers to compete with cheap, subsidised surpluses from the EU), Germany (weapon deals), China, and many others depending on region.

It's easy to point the finger to just the US, but in reality it's been European colonialism that started most of the mess in the first place. Just compare the borders in Africa and the Middle East to the borders in Europe and you might get an idea why peace and prosperity might be a long ways away.

> Most criminals are criminals because of the circumstances. Circumstances can be improved but they'd rather spend 5.5 billion (the one after the million) € on Eurofighters than make away with poverty.

The EU alone has a population of 440M. 5.5Bn is just 12.5€/person. Say 1 in 1000 people within the EU can be considered poor, that's still just 12500€ per poor person. That might be great for a year in many places, but then you'd have the same problem again next year. And the year after that, and the year after that...

Circumstances can be improved, but it doesn't start with money. The first step needs to be the disbandment of ghettos - way too many migrant families are segregated into their own streets, city blocks and quarters. Their children are stigmatised from birth and discrimination starts at an early age.

These people don't need money - they need a perspective, a fair chance, and acceptance. As long as football fans throw racial slurs even at their own players and as long as your country of birth, ethnic- and social background determines your future more than your skills, personality and hard work, being a terrorist or criminal has more appeal than being a productive part of society.


Your view of reality is that of a severely coddled person. In reality, you cannot have rich without poor, unless you suggest literal communism. Even in Scandinavian utopias, people rape, steal and murder.

Please wake up from the fairy tale that all bad things have a just cause that can be fixed. No. Some people would rather steal your stuff than go to the trouble of getting their own legitimately.


How do we stop terrorism and criminals if we can't use encryption technology for ourselves?

There's only hundreds of bad guys (maybe), but there's millions of us. Where do you think the balance should be here? Who should be stronger?


> My serious question is this: how do we stop terrorism and criminals when they have access to military grade encryption technology?

You don't and technology has nothing to with it either.

Terrorism is as old as government itself and doesn't need the internet in order to function.

Radicalisation takes place in many places and law enforcement as well as national intelligence agencies have put their focus away from good old-fashioned police work, infiltration and observation towards telecommunication.

There was no internet in 1972, yet the Munich Olympiad Massacre happened. Just take a look at a random year pre-internet: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_terrorist_incidents_in...

Terrorism is neither a new phenomenon nor boosted by the internet - it's our perception that has been boosted. Today, every single incident is instantly known and international news.

People just seem to have forgotten that terrorism was pretty much part of daily life in past decades, too (the German version seems to be more complete, listing terror attacks without fatalities as well: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_von_Terroranschlägen_im_... )

Exchange of information and coordination doesn't require encrypted internet technology at all.

In Spain, ETA declared a new ceasefire in 2010 presumably because political parties with ties to them were banned and a leading member died (of undisclosed cause).

In Germany, the left-wing terror group RAF disbanded in 1998 after key members had been arrested and the 1991 collapse of the Soviet Union, Germany reunification and the subsequent disintegration of the communist bloc basically robbed them of their ideological base, support structures and legitimisation.

The whole IRA business seemed somewhat sorted with the Good Friday Agreement in 1998, but in the aftermath of Brexit tensions seem to start to raise again.

Basically, politics, old school police work and having a close eye on organisations are much more effective than mass surveillance and technology.

You won't be able to catch every "lone wolf" - be that the right-wing extremist who starts a mass shooting or the Islamic extremist who randomly stabs people.

But you can avoid a lot of it by enforcing a zero-tolerance policy (most of the recent extremist terrorists had a criminal record), deporting criminals, shutting down organisations that support terrorism (including mosques if applicable) and drying out sources of finance.

Mass surveillance, bans, and thought crime (i.e. "hate speech", which is basically a blanket term for "I am offended" these days) are not viable solutions.


I think you missed the part where law enforcement has problems putting criminals behind bars because there is too little evidence. This happens all the time.


Three of the terrorists involved in recent attacks in Germany and Austria had been behind bars already.

This is not as big a problem as it's made out to be. These guys aren't mobsters or professional fraudsters - they're violent criminals and (domestic) terrorists with no regards for covering their tracks.




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