Asking for pay scales is a problem though. Do it at the start of the interview and you're flying in the face of all interview advice (i.e., don't ask about pay during the initial phone screen; the companies smart enough to save their own time will mention it upfront, and the companies that want to negotiate you as low as possible by hiding information will take it as a red flag), and at the end I don't care what the range for the position is; I want to know what they're going to offer -me-.

I guess if at the end I felt especially lowballed, but at that point I don't really care what their scale is; it's too low for me to want to take it. I guess if I didn't have a job, felt like I had to take it, it provides some extra information at that point to try and negotiate with?

Seems pretty straightforward to me. "For alignment, can you provide the salary range for this position?" If they hedge, just tell them you want to make sure we're not waisting time.